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OK here we go... *BEST* HEROIN-INFLUENCED SHOW - EVER!!!

 
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What's the best heroin year? (time when Jerry was on the horse)
1981 - 1984 (most believe he STARTED HEAVY in early 81')
80%
 80%  [ 8 ]
1985 (most argue this was *the* heroin year)
10%
 10%  [ 1 ]
1986 (*some* argue this was the year, not 1985)
10%
 10%  [ 1 ]
1987 - 1988 (*most* will say he was only kinda high for these two years)
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
1989 - 1991 (Right before the methadone clinic...)
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
1993 - 1995 (Yes he DID take a break for 1992! Then...well you know)
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 10

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greenfox



Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Posts: 58

PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 8:09 pm    Post subject: OK here we go... *BEST* HEROIN-INFLUENCED SHOW - EVER!!! Reply with quote

OK here we are and away we go.. I want answers, damnit!~ :)

So here's the deal: I want shows with heroin influence that sound GRATE. I have my reasons.

Now please keep in mind, (and most of you know this, or at least you SHOULD,) "heroin influence" does not NECESSARILY EQUAL bad show.... it CAN be a bad show, but that's not what I'm looking for.

I'm looking for the LOWEST, *BEST* show where it's just so fucking obvious that it's borderline sad. Basically, I want the BEST *(VERY BEST) heroin-influenced show.

Here's a couple that I don't want you to list, because god knows I already have:

--------------------------------------

10/30/84- Berkeley Community Theater - Berkeley, CA
07/13/84- Greek Theater, University Of California - Berkeley, CA
07/14/84- Greek Theater, University Of California - Berkeley, CA (duh on both)
07/02/86- Rubber Bowl - Akron, OH (Dylan was arguably higher than Jerry)
08/11/87- Red Rocks Amphitheater - Morrison, CO
08/12/87- Red Rocks Amphitheater - Morrison, CO
08/13/87- Red Rocks Amphitheater - Morrison, CO (so high for all three shwos)

--------------------------------------


OK that's it for now.

So throw `em at me. Emphasis on low Losers, Shakedowns, Wharfys, and other tunes that sound great when Low.w...w.w.w.w.w.w.

I mean... I want to hear it in his voice. I want to nod just from hearing the stuff strum. I want to be able to lay it down in Winamp and have people laugh at me because I'm trying to snort the dust on the bottom of my mouse, mistaking the music for junk.

I want to fumblefuck and try in vain to type the addy because the VERY THOUGHT of the show makes me low.

So what'cha got?!?!? :)

Can't wait.

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Kochman
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I went with 85...

4/7/85, where Kermit the Frog is at his highest

10/31/85 - SLOPPY

12/31/85 - (not) just like a Swiss Watch


Of course, I always wondered which shows were influenced by which drugs... was there a straight show? Where everyone in the band was sober? Was there a show where more than just Jerry was sober?

Hard to know really. Given that this is all just guess work based on trends we noticed and 10th hand stories....
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wvhead



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmmm....

howsa bout 12/31/84...to back up a bit...


10/12/84, 10/14/84...this tour ALWAYS sounds heroinesque to me...

10/14 has a very LOW Loser...this show sort of personifies opiates for me, i was thinking that just the other day.

in sum, 1984 represents to me the lowest of the heroin years while still featuring some absolutely incredible shows...'83 a close second.
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Duderino



Joined: 09 Jul 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're saying he was doped up at the 87 RR shows?? Confused
That being said, 8/11/87 is a superb show.
It was my impression that during 87 is was pretty clean, if not completely off the Persian.
I think of 85 is being less about the smack, and more about the nose candy- faster tempos, fewer dreamy jams etc..You can practically hear the post nasal drip on 4/27/85

I would say 84, followed by 83 would be the top junk influenced years.
I would have to concur with 10/12 and 10/14/84 as good examples. Also
10/15/84 with the Scarlet>Fire>Playin is pretty "low"
Spring - 4/14 Hampton
Summer 84
6/14, 6/21, 6/27, 6/29, 6/30, 7/6, 7/7 (after a rough 1st set they pull it together for an amazing 2nd set - the Playin>China Doll oozes..)

Sept/Oct 83 as well.
- 9/4, 9/6, 10/11, 10/12 10/15
6/18/83 and 6/20/83 are pretty junked up, but in a good way

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swamiGD80s
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

1981-1984.

6/30/84 Indianapolis.

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Gopher



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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 11:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of the years listed, I like Jerry's playing the best in '81. But the heroin sound is most evident in 1984, specifically October.

This is just a guess, but I imagine he performed on some dope in the late 70's. 10/17/78 has that feel.
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greenfox



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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Duderino wrote:
You're saying he was doped up at the 87 RR shows?? Confused
That being said, 8/11/87 is a superb show.
It was my impression that during 87 is was pretty clean, if not completely off the Persian.

(SNIPPITY BIPPITY BOPPITY BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOP POOP!)
((TRANSLATION: THAT BASICALLY means I'm politely telling your theory (not you, brother or sister, whichever way your [CENSORED] swings,) to [CENSORED] OFF - because its so wrong if it was any more wrong it would be RIGHT as rain.

Or RIGHT as Bolivian cocaine. Arrow Arrow Take your pick. Rolling Eyes




OK the point? How do I *KNOW*??! Because I ate shrimp with the fatman at this show. At the beginning of set 1, someone stole Jerry's dope. I might say it was Ramrod if it were possible, but we all know about that. Now this story gets mixed up- a LOT- but basically, yeah, he was high- or maybe UN-high because he got hotter than a ghetto torch on a crack riz-ock and was SCREAMING, and I quote, "I won't play until I get my dope back!!!" If you listen to the AUD, right before SET tuning, (listen to the Shustier AUD- its the only one that has it and is audible,) but right before tuning he was SCREAMING, "SOMEONE STOLE MY MUTHA-FUCKING STASH!!! I WANT IT BACK RIGHT *NOW!!!* Right this FUCKING minute!!!"

and etc, and even more etc.....

and then they dissapeared for about five minutes, and Jerry came back, WITH his trad's sunglasses, and played played played the night away.

He was, without a doubt, lower than green fox [CENSORED] baking in the summer sun. Yeah- that fucking low.

Who asks 40,000 people (at once) to return their drugs?!?!? Only Jerry, and the CLASSIC part was - the bag circled around and found its way up to the stage,. The book of Jerry, (not to be confused with the book of revelations,) speculates that about 90% was still there. I guess so because Jer bear was happier than a maggot in skunk faces, and the FUNNIEST PART?!?? Well just think about it for a minute: (you all know what THINKING is right?) *(Im just messin'- I love ya all!) -
Wink but PONDER THIS: I *SUPPOSE* that it was more important to see jerry the berry high and playing guit-box-ar.... MORE IMPORTANT to see the ALMIGHTY jamming that was the china white.....er.. I mean.. China Doll... more IMPORTANT to hear the MASTERPIECE (and to know WHEN I paint it,) HELL even MORE IMPORTANT than Black Muddy River being sung in super low key... MORE IMPORTANT on all of these things *****OVER***** being the shame to claim, standing apart on a mountain top, screaming essentially from the highest (hah) rafters,

(and I quote- you do, too! [CENSORED] s... lovely [CENSORED] s and [CENSORED] -ess-es-es///) .....

((AND I >>QUOTE<<!!!)) :

"I fucking have fucking Jerry the bearrry's fucking, [CENSORED] fuck fucking [CENSORED] fuck fuckity fuck,,, fucking ... I FUCKING.. no I straight up HAVE Jerry's STASH!!!!!!!!"

or much more plainly and to the point, ONE person screaming to the other 39,999 people, :

"Jerry will NOT be playing tonight, but that's ok, because....

I STOLE/GOT JERRY's DOPE STASH!!!!"


lol can you even imagine/?!?!?? So YES it was a good show, but NO SHOW FOR YOU because... someone stole Jerry's shit. If I was the fat man, (well I wouldn't be, in fact, Id rather be a hot [CENSORED] but that's another story,) but *IF* I was the fatman, I would Be PISSED too!

Can you even imagine?!? And let's assume you somehow managed to dope and time travel and you GET his stash bag,,, can u even think straight as to how incredibly FUCKED you are......

People, people, PEOPLE!!! Come on now, u wouldnt love it up!?? I bet you would.

Don't lie. YOU HAVE FURRY WET DREAMS about having access to Jerry's lifetime stash for FIVE FURRY FUCKING MINUTES!!!!

Could u even deal?!? I doubt it. Would you want to?!? Probably. Even if you hate it, wouldn't you get low with Jerry if he asked? You can sound all magnanamous and say, "ohhh.,... no I would *NEVER&*!! I NEVER!!"

LOL yeah right. We all know it's a spicey meatball. You'd not only ride the horses with Jerry, but you'd share his pin- out of the principle to say, "yeah I fucked Jerry but not in a gay way... OUR BLOOD RUNS TOGETHER!"

Yeah it's a lot of hyper babble but...

Was I making a POINT?

Yeah a few pointz:

a) I love the jear-bear, I have wet dreams about being best dope buddies, rock scully style
b) yes he WAS high in 87 because he started on the 'done less than a year later, (too bad they didn't have suboxone in Jer-bears day,)
c) I'm drooling at my KB right now, BECAUSE
d) I'm low as fuck. NOT JUST LOW (it was a mighty foxy shotsky,) you know it...

but FINALLY

e) I'm lowing off to the best low-dope song ever. Want to know which one?!? Easy peazzzy. LOL check it out":


SECOND LOWEST LOSER EVER *I MEAN FUCKING EVER FIND A LOWER ONE I *DARE* you!!!!) :: which is::

SECOND LOWEST LOSER EVER:
11-02-84

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LOWEST FUCKING LOSER EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :
06-08-92

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OK wait a second... switch those around- it was supposed to be 06-08-92 is the second lowest loser ever...

but if you want to LOW OFF JUST LISTENING TO IT (*I DARE YOU!!!) then listen to:

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oy I quit. I can't get it staight. Actually i changed my mind again-

THE LOWEST LOSER EVER OUT OF THE THREE IS DEFINITELY:

Grateful DeadGrateful Dead Live at Berkeley Community Theater on 1984-11-02 (November 2, 1984)


OK Ive babbled enough

no wait it's all a lie.

*THE* LOWEST LOSER EVER=

Grateful Dead Live at Broome County Arena on 1983-04-12 (April 12, 1983)


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(God its SOOOO HARD TO KEEP IT ALL STRAIGHT!!!!)

now listen to that Loser and say I'm lying. Esp. the solo.

If you find a lower Loser, you get a surprise- you'll like it.

Consider it a challenge.

And ALSO: if you can SORT THROUGH THE PAST THREE PAGES OF CRAP, you get a prize FOR THAT ALONE!!!!!!!!!

LOL!!!! try me. :) I DARE you!!!! Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing


OK NOW I'm.... Arrow DONE! Shocked Cool Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil

LOL peace. And I DARE YOU to sort through and make sense of my heroin babble... I DOUBLE DOPE DOG JERRY DARE YOU! *(and that's a FUCKING dare!!!) PEACE my sha'nizza's...... ;) Love ya all. Get low! (but BE SAFE! or you'll be shooting dope with Jerry sooner than you think...)

peace.

sig,fik,
-=gf

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Duderino



Joined: 09 Jul 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

greenfox wrote:
Duderino wrote:
You're saying he was doped up at the 87 RR shows?? Confused
That being said, 8/11/87 is a superb show.
It was my impression that during 87 is was pretty clean, if not completely off the Persian.

(SNIPPITY BIPPITY BOPPITY BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOP POOP!)
((TRANSLATION: THAT BASICALLY means I'm politely telling your theory (not you, brother or sister, whichever way your [CENSORED] swings,) to [CENSORED] OFF - because its so wrong if it was any more wrong it would be RIGHT as rain.

Or RIGHT as Bolivian cocaine. Arrow Arrow Take your pick. Rolling Eyes




OK the point? How do I *KNOW*??! Because I ate shrimp with the fatman at this show. At the beginning of set 1, someone stole Jerry's dope. I might say it was Ramrod if it were possible, but we all know about that. Now this story gets mixed up- a LOT- but basically, yeah, he was high- or maybe UN-high because he got hotter than a ghetto torch on a crack riz-ock and was SCREAMING, and I quote, "I won't play until I get my dope back!!!" If you listen to the AUD, right before SET tuning, (listen to the Shustier AUD- its the only one that has it and is audible,) but right before tuning he was SCREAMING, "SOMEONE STOLE MY MUTHA-FUCKING STASH!!! I WANT IT BACK RIGHT *NOW!!!* Right this FUCKING minute!!!"

and etc, and even more etc.....

and then they dissapeared for about five minutes, and Jerry came back, WITH his trad's sunglasses, and played played played the night away.

He was, without a doubt, lower than green fox [CENSORED] baking in the summer sun. Yeah- that fucking low.

Who asks 40,000 people (at once) to return their drugs?!?!? Only Jerry, and the CLASSIC part was - the bag circled around and found its way up to the stage,. The book of Jerry, (not to be confused with the book of revelations,) speculates that about 90% was still there. I guess so because Jer bear was happier than a maggot in skunk faces, and the FUNNIEST PART?!?? Well just think about it for a minute: (you all know what THINKING is right?) *(Im just messin'- I love ya all!) -
Wink but PONDER THIS: I *SUPPOSE* that it was more important to see jerry the berry high and playing guit-box-ar.... MORE IMPORTANT to see the ALMIGHTY jamming that was the china white.....er.. I mean.. China Doll... more IMPORTANT to hear the MASTERPIECE (and to know WHEN I paint it,) HELL even MORE IMPORTANT than Black Muddy River being sung in super low key... MORE IMPORTANT on all of these things *****OVER***** being the shame to claim, standing apart on a mountain top, screaming essentially from the highest (hah) rafters,

(and I quote- you do, too! [CENSORED] s... lovely [CENSORED] s and [CENSORED] -ess-es-es///) .....

((AND I >>QUOTE<<!!!)) :

"I fucking have fucking Jerry the bearrry's fucking, [CENSORED] fuck fucking [CENSORED] fuck fuckity fuck,,, fucking ... I FUCKING.. no I straight up HAVE Jerry's STASH!!!!!!!!"

or much more plainly and to the point, ONE person screaming to the other 39,999 people, :

"Jerry will NOT be playing tonight, but that's ok, because....

I STOLE/GOT JERRY's DOPE STASH!!!!"


lol can you even imagine/?!?!?? So YES it was a good show, but NO SHOW FOR YOU because... someone stole Jerry's shit. If I was the fat man, (well I wouldn't be, in fact, Id rather be a hot [CENSORED] but that's another story,) but *IF* I was the fatman, I would Be PISSED too!

Can you even imagine?!? And let's assume you somehow managed to dope and time travel and you GET his stash bag,,, can u even think straight as to how incredibly FUCKED you are......

People, people, PEOPLE!!! Come on now, u wouldnt love it up!?? I bet you would.

Don't lie. YOU HAVE FURRY WET DREAMS about having access to Jerry's lifetime stash for FIVE FURRY FUCKING MINUTES!!!!

Could u even deal?!? I doubt it. Would you want to?!? Probably. Even if you hate it, wouldn't you get low with Jerry if he asked? You can sound all magnanamous and say, "ohhh.,... no I would *NEVER&*!! I NEVER!!"

LOL yeah right. We all know it's a spicey meatball. You'd not only ride the horses with Jerry, but you'd share his pin- out of the principle to say, "yeah I fucked Jerry but not in a gay way... OUR BLOOD RUNS TOGETHER!"

Yeah it's a lot of hyper babble but...

Was I making a POINT?

Yeah a few pointz:

a) I love the jear-bear, I have wet dreams about being best dope buddies, rock scully style
b) yes he WAS high in 87 because he started on the 'done less than a year later, (too bad they didn't have suboxone in Jer-bears day,)
c) I'm drooling at my KB right now, BECAUSE
d) I'm low as fuck. NOT JUST LOW (it was a mighty foxy shotsky,) you know it...

but FINALLY

e) I'm lowing off to the best low-dope song ever. Want to know which one?!? Easy peazzzy. LOL check it out":


SECOND LOWEST LOSER EVER *I MEAN FUCKING EVER FIND A LOWER ONE I *DARE* you!!!!) :: which is::

SECOND LOWEST LOSER EVER:
11-02-84

Only registered users can see links on this forum!
Register or Login on forum!



LOWEST FUCKING LOSER EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :
06-08-92

Only registered users can see links on this forum!
Register or Login on forum!





OK wait a second... switch those around- it was supposed to be 06-08-92 is the second lowest loser ever...

but if you want to LOW OFF JUST LISTENING TO IT (*I DARE YOU!!!) then listen to:

Only registered users can see links on this forum!
Register or Login on forum!



oy I quit. I can't get it staight. Actually i changed my mind again-

THE LOWEST LOSER EVER OUT OF THE THREE IS DEFINITELY:

Grateful DeadGrateful Dead Live at Berkeley Community Theater on 1984-11-02 (November 2, 1984)


OK Ive babbled enough

no wait it's all a lie.

*THE* LOWEST LOSER EVER=

Grateful Dead Live at Broome County Arena on 1983-04-12 (April 12, 1983)


Only registered users can see links on this forum!
Register or Login on forum!



(God its SOOOO HARD TO KEEP IT ALL STRAIGHT!!!!)

now listen to that Loser and say I'm lying. Esp. the solo.

If you find a lower Loser, you get a surprise- you'll like it.

Consider it a challenge.

And ALSO: if you can SORT THROUGH THE PAST THREE PAGES OF CRAP, you get a prize FOR THAT ALONE!!!!!!!!!

LOL!!!! try me. :) I DARE you!!!! Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing


OK NOW I'm.... Arrow DONE! Shocked Cool Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil

LOL peace. And I DARE YOU to sort through and make sense of my heroin babble... I DOUBLE DOPE DOG JERRY DARE YOU! *(and that's a FUCKING dare!!!) PEACE my sha'nizza's...... ;) Love ya all. Get low! (but BE SAFE! or you'll be shooting dope with Jerry sooner than you think...)

peace.

sig,fik,
-=gf

Alrighty then!! You're Crazy

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greenfox



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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 12:50 pm    Post subject: one lAST thing: Reply with quote

Yeah yeah double posting... I got a double post right below the belt... wanna have a sip? Rolling Eyes Shocked Wink

nah that's nasty and I'm just kidding;

Here's a VERY close runner up (I have a LIST of LOW losers.. and this one is on the VERY TOP!)

if you check out NONE of my other links, check this out- i BEG you:



11-02-1984
Grateful Dead Live at Berkeley Community Theater on 1984-11-02 (November 2, 1984)


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care to NOT believe me? PLEASE assume it's the biggest lie ever, and check THIS one out yourself (PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I want FEEDBACk and not the 1968 variety,)

but this Loser is so low, it should be illegal. Literally. I think I tried burning this track on a cd, melting the CD down into a spoon, and shooting it... literally.

No I'm serious.

This is the HIGEST i have ever heard him and have it still sound great, This show is *THE* example that sum of Jer-bear's works are low but still GRATE! I mean it. Esp. the solo. No SERIOUSLY this one has to be listened to ........ to be believed.

The solo is fucking NUTS and still so damn low.
His voice just drags away.
And the solo itself is about twice as long as it should be.

Wat duz it tell u when the Loser (*first set) is so fucking good and/or low that they have to play it longer.

OK that's it. Just... PLEASE....check that show out and comment. I'm drolling on my KB again so I gotta go.
Cool

peace my nigs. L:O:V:E you all -f or realz. !! Foxy loves ya. :)

Peace


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and....
and of COURSE....
and I mean SERIOUSLY.... :

well I can't get it to load. I had a picture of low Jerry

but

you all get the Arrow "point"

yah that's right I said it. Now go listen to that show.

The smokestack is amazing,

peace
sig,fik,
=-gf

wait.. just found it.

I *DARE* you to tell me Jerry's not low at THIS show: (I DARE YOU!!!)

here you go, ONE For the ROAD lol :




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k... im dun like a tv dinner,. peace my sha-nizzies.. :) later.

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swamiGD80s
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 1:12 pm    Post subject: Loser Reply with quote

Great selection of Losers by my favorite winner, G-fox.

Those BCT shows (10/27/84-11/3/04) I have decided are my favorite run of shows ever............yes, ever.

Foxy - epic posting....does this mean that you are appreciating 1984 more these days musically, or only in relation to Jerry's heroin use?

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Kochman
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fox, I have two follow up questions.

No one here can really follow your story, because it is strange. Can you follow your story?

Also... How do you come up with this stuff? Were you in a nod at the time?
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elvans692



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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

green fox.....www.bettyfordclinic.com

give it a try
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greenfox



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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 6:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Loser Reply with quote

swamiGD80s wrote:
Great selection of Losers by my favorite winner, G-fox.

Those BCT shows (10/27/84-11/3/04) I have decided are my favorite run of shows ever............yes, ever.

Foxy - epic posting....does this mean that you are appreciating 1984 more these days musically, or only in relation to Jerry's heroin use?


lo.... BOTH! if u can beleive THAT! :)

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fillmoreeast



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess I may be in the minority here--but why is this relevant?

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 6:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fillmoreeast wrote:
I guess I may be in the minority here--but why is this relevant?


You are in the silent majority.
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greenfox



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PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

elvans692 wrote:
green fox.....www.bettyfordclinic.com

give it a try


LOL! As if.

You want my "story"? Read this:

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OK now that's out of the way...

hear me when I say.. I've been in rehab- three times. I'm on suboxone now... that doesn't mean I don't get low.

And don't knock the [CENSORED] that you can't possibly understand. Not in ten lifetimes. S eriously.

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greenfox



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PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kochman wrote:
fillmoreeast wrote:
I guess I may be in the minority here--but why is this relevant?


You are in the silent majority.


Jerry would :


a) laugh (most likely)
b) slap you - hard
c) just shrug and walk off


---

it's "relevent" because music IS a drug. Don't believe me? SOUND stimulates the SAME receptors in the brain that heroin stimulates ( I [CENSORED] you not- it's the BC5-HT23 receptor sites, also known as the "kappa - endorphin" sites) - this is science not speculation

Jerry's "heroin" WAS music.

Mine too.

Heroin is just a means to an end, nothing more. It's an opiate- the oldest used drug in HISTORY- older and more widely used than pot,

(reference: OPIATES: A History by Jack Clark OR Pharmako/Poeia by Dale Pendell)

it's damn near a revelation for me. Literally.

And some people get it, some don't. If you DO get it, that doesn't mean your a junkie, and if you DON'T get it that doesn't mean you're "clean" - it's all subjective anyways.

But Grateful Dead and the music therein is literally the MOST "opiate-like" music there is. ALL music has its relative drug references./

I'll give you a few examples:

Cannibal Corpse = amphetamines (definitely- no question here)
Pink Floyd = weed
Lou Reed, the grateful dead, etc, etc = HEROIN/ opiates
Elf vs. Coil, the Crystal Method = MDMA
Lynard Skynard (sp?) = beer, alcohol
EARLY Dead and EARLY Floyd = tryptamines
RAP = tribal beats = trance music - (it's the most BASIC "chemical drug" music, which not to sound rascist, but it IS "undeveloped" =- very basic= beats and tribal trance, which is WHY its so inclined towards blacks)

we can go on and on with this, but EVEN THE MOST SOBER PERSON IN THE WORLD- well if they love music then they are a drug addict. It's the SAME thing as the guy who RUNS AND RUNS AND RUNS- that's generating endorphins- which is converted to endomorphine which is then converted to ENDOendorphin- the rawest pleasure chemical there is. It's so primal that it's sick and not even worth discussing. Once again, science- not conjecture...


SO THE POINT?!?!?

when Jerry was "low" and producing "low music" (music that stimulates the receptor sites that opiates stimulate,)... well... it "goes together" - it's very fitting.

And weather or not he understood the actual biochemisty is completely irrelevant. It really is.

The point is?:

I get low, *YOU* get low.. even if you've never popped a perc, the point is that you are INCLINED to like THIS TYPE of music over...say...rap, which means you are CHEMICALLY PRE-DISPOSED to enjoy opiate-based drugs/music (they are one in the same)

If you have questions on the chemistry of this , please ask, I can give references and I'd be more than happy to explain WHY and HOW music *******IS******** definitely a drug- no questions asked.

Feel free- that's why you love the fox and that's why the fox is so fucking green... ;)

Peace.

sig,fik,(I mean seriously- tell me ***ALL*** that you know....)

peace...
-=gf

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elvans692



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PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dude if that diatribe is your rational for you being a junkie, then power to you..You come off like a ranting lunatic and make a perfect example to anyone on why they should avoid drugs at any cost.

Be clear, just because you are able to somehow glorify and rationalize it doesnt make it any more romantic..Its sad bro
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Kochman
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 12:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

greenfox wrote:
Kochman wrote:
fillmoreeast wrote:
I guess I may be in the minority here--but why is this relevant?


You are in the silent majority.


Jerry would :


a) laugh (most likely)
b) slap you - hard
c) just shrug and walk off



Jerry died at 53 precisely because he couldn't do item C.
For item B, I would've beat the crap out of Jerry, and I think we all know that... I am the only one who knows secret ninja moves from the government.
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Duderino



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have no problem with mind altering substances, and god knows I'm no saint, but my observations about H is that well, it sucks users into a vortex, becomes your life and potentially can kill you. Always scared the crap out of me. One of my good friends OD'ed and died about 10 years ago. Started off as a happy-go-lucky tourhead, and ended up a junkie dead in his bathroom. sad. Another long term friend got into it and various scrips, lost his license as a pharmacist (I know an ironic profession...) and pretty much ruined his life. Do what you want but be careful, greenfox.

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greenfox



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Duderino wrote:
I have no problem with mind altering substances, and god knows I'm no saint, but my observations about H is that well, it sucks users into a vortex, becomes your life and potentially can kill you. Always scared the crap out of me. One of my good friends OD'ed and died about 10 years ago. Started off as a happy-go-lucky tourhead, and ended up a junkie dead in his bathroom. sad. Another long term friend got into it and various scrips, lost his license as a pharmacist (I know an ironic profession...) and pretty much ruined his life. Do what you want but be careful, greenfox.


I will and I do.

And it's funny- whenever I start talking about smack people get real defensive. It's ok- and to Koch: thanks for taking it easy. And to the poster right above: I'm not "rationalizing" being a junkie. I know what I am and who I am. I never steal anything for my "habit" and for that matter it really isn't a "habit" if you do it once every 45-60 days now is it? Yes I'm on suboxone (30.00 a month through insurence) AND ITs legal. For those that know: it doesn't "get you high" - it's not a full agonist - it's a partial opiate agonist which means it only covers the sites it doesn't stimulate them. The pill ALSO contains nalaxone which prevents you shooting it- and nalaxone is an opiate blocker so when I'm taking my medication like I do like I should it BLOCKS any other opiates- I could literally try to shoot a bindle and nothing would happen- nada- zip- nothing.;

lastly; don't be so scared of heroin. YES it's deadly./ YES it's addictive. But then again, gas is deadly. Should you be "scared" of it? Or do you treat it with respect and put it in your car and drive around on it all day? Same thing. The most common thing I hear about h is that "so and so died on it" - I'm not calling you a liar. I know people die on it every day. When I was doing it heavy, yeah, I was on diff. opiates for 10 + years. The only problem I had was addiction- which I took MYSELF into rehab for (I wasnt forced- I went on my own when enough was enough) ((and paid for it myself, might I add...))

As far as "rationalizing" it./...I'm really not. You do what YOU want I'll do what I want. Free choice is probably the number one thing about the dead that makes it special- it was the "credo" for the band and it's following. I'm not telling you to go shoot dope- in fact, it's probably a bad idea overall. BUt I'm telling YOU that I can control my shit- and surely I can. I take my subs every single day and once in a GREAT while, when I have the money and the desire (I don't steal and I don't care), I'll take a shot. I don't have any STDS (I've been tested several times, but not that it matters, I've NEVER shared gear,) I don't have ANY collapsed veins or anything like that- and I've NEVER od'd (you start VERY VERY small- you don't "do what you always do",) so why is this? How is it that I've managed to escape (almost) all the negative consequences associated with it? And still do it with little to no problems (other than the financial hit of 30 dollars a month, which is VERY VERY inexpensive) - because there's a huge difference between the junkie stealing from YOU with no job and no hope vs. this sly fox with ALL my expensive electronic toys and HDDs and my job and my family and my terrabytes and terrabytes of dead.... that's not fantasy, that my reality. And it's fucking great.

Am I telling *YOU* to shoot dope? Absolutely not.

Am I telling you that most people can do it with LITTLE to no consequences? No because most people don't know when to quit or have the self respect to take themselves into rehab if they get too far.

Am I telling you that for ME, it's MY choice and I don't let it effect my everyday living?

ABsolutely.

And if you respect ANYTHING that the dead culture has taught, you'll respect my free choice.

Thank you to those of you that understand.

To the rest:

"a box of rain will ease your pain..."

peace

sig,fik,
-=gf

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Kochman
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with Dave.
Also, you classify the GD as "Heroin" music. Interestingly, you yourself are quoted many times as liking the 60s Dead.
I believe I read that they hadn't started using H until post-retirement.

So, they were creating Heroin music, as you put it, before having used it? Please explain. I know they were revolutionary and all, but having the experience before doing it?
On second thought, don't explain. I am sure you would, and it would be long and confusing, semi-coherent... and that is great, but I think the just of it is...

It's your life, but dude, give it a rest already. It is great you have this outlet... but you should understand, whether you think it is needed or not, some people here are trying to reach out to you, because, as we all know, Heroin has overpowered more users than users that have overpowered Heroin. They care about you, whether they have met you, or even want to meet you.

I also suspect that some are just tired of reading defenses about Heroin, particularly those who have similarly struggled, but choose not to talk about it all the time.

The bottom line is... the Grateful Dead rock. They used a lot of different drugs at different points of their 30 years, to varying degrees of success or failure at different points. Sure, cocaine probably fueled some awesome Jerry noodling... etc. If you find that drugs enhance your musical experience with the Dead, I think you are not alone. A number of people don't drug anymore (or never even did), but they find the Grateful Dead is awesome as you do.

I don't take any drugs... well, unless you count the socially accepted ones that aren't illegal. Haven't for years. I absolutely love the GD. Its about the music, not the drugs.
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greenfox



Joined: 10 Jul 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:52 am    Post subject: My last thoughts Reply with quote

Look Koch: I agree with you for real. Ummm but for seriousness now... uh... yeah...

Let's get this topic back on track. I don't really want to continue this opiate debate- it's off track and obviously I'm fighting an uphill battle. ... so INSTEAD let's do it to it.

And Koch yeah I can explain:

the PRIMAL [CENSORED] IS where it's at. No smack. Just life drug influences- like LSD. and on one other note: Jerrys first show was all about the fucking umm... yeah.... London or France show of what was it? 73- it's the fist time Jerry got low. Lesh wasn't much better with his coke habit,. [CENSORED] you guys know this but: The first album was made on speed (it's true!) The second album was made with tryptamines. Shakedown Street was the valium album- not just speculation but fact,

A true sense of wonder!

So lets get t

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Gopher



Joined: 12 Jul 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 6:00 pm    Post subject: Re: My last thoughts Reply with quote

greenfox wrote:


Shakedown Street was the valium album- not just speculation but fact,



I could be wrong, but I read somewhere that Jerry was alergic to valium and almost died when they gave it to him at a hospital.

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swamiGD80s
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:14 pm    Post subject: drugz Reply with quote

I agree with Greenfox - the music is a drug, according to a reasonable definition of the word. Distinctions between chemical substances and real activities producing the same sensations can themselves be irrelevant - in the context of a discussion of the end effect.

Jerry did heroin - why should we ignore, discount or refuse to analyze his usage and it's effects, if any, on the music?

More importantly, why should we disparage Greenfox?! I love the rants Foxy - keep 'em comin..... and I make no judgement of Greenfox's personal lifestyle. We are all addicted to things - some more damaging than others.

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greenfox



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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:37 pm    Post subject: Re: drugz Reply with quote

swamiGD80s wrote:
I agree with Greenfox - the music is a drug, according to a reasonable definition of the word. Distinctions between chemical substances and real activities producing the same sensations can themselves be irrelevant - in the context of a discussion of the end effect.

Jerry did heroin - why should we ignore, discount or refuse to analyze his usage and it's effects, if any, on the music?

More importantly, why should we disparage Greenfox?! I love the rants Foxy - keep 'em comin..... and I make no judgement of Greenfox's personal lifestyle. We are all addicted to things - some more damaging than others.


Holy [CENSORED] and amen someone got it balls to the wall dead accurate on.

I can't even add to this- there's nothing more that can be said! And with THAT I leave you with Jerry's FIRST "h" show- listen to the eyes - the FIRST persian experience was during setbreak- Rock brought it back into the dressing room. And tell me that this eyes doesn't sound TOTALLY different than ANY eyes you've ever heard before:



09/20/74
Palais Des Sports - Paris, XFrance

Set 1:
Cumberland Blues
Jack Straw
It Must Have Been The Roses
Beat It On Down The Line
Scarlet Begonias
Black-Throated Wind
Friend Of The Devil
El Paso
Row Jimmy
WRS Prelude
WRS Part 1
Let It Grow
Stella Blue
Around And Around

Set 2:
China Cat Sunflower
I Know You Rider
Big River
Brown-Eyed Women
Greatest Story Ever Told
Brokedown Palace
Truckin'
Eyes Of The World
Not Fade Away
Goin' Down The Road Feelin' Bad
One More Saturday Night

Encore:
U.S. Blues

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greenfox



Joined: 10 Jul 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:40 pm    Post subject: Re: My last thoughts Reply with quote

Gopher wrote:
greenfox wrote:


Shakedown Street was the valium album- not just speculation but fact,



I could be wrong, but I read somewhere that Jerry was alergic to valium and almost died when they gave it to him at a hospital.


I think his allergy was to lorazapam not diazapam- same family, different drugs.

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bzfgt



Joined: 11 Sep 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He was clean in 1992??!? Wow, that year sucked hard, maybe he should have stayed on the shit. 1993 is better than 1992, even though it's nothing to write home about...
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GracefulDuck



Joined: 26 Mar 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Berkeley Greek Theater 1982 shows may be the shows that display the "magic" of Heroin. Shocked
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swamiGD80s
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GracefulDuck wrote:
Berkeley Greek Theater 1982 shows may be the shows that display the "magic" of Heroin. Shocked


I was just thinking about 5-22-82 and how much I love it today - will be giving that one a spin in the near future. Just an awesome show start-to-finish.

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spencer540



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PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 7:30 pm    Post subject: Re: My last thoughts Reply with quote

greenfox wrote:
Lesh wasn't much better with his coke habit


I always thought he was the clean one of the band?! (and by clean, I mean he just stuck to grass and lsd)

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Duderino



Joined: 09 Jul 2008
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Location: Baltimore

PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:28 am    Post subject: Re: My last thoughts Reply with quote

spencer540 wrote:
greenfox wrote:
Lesh wasn't much better with his coke habit


I always thought he was the clean one of the band?! (and by clean, I mean he just stuck to grass and lsd)

Lesh was apparently into the speed in the 60's, i'm sure gobbled acid like the rest of the them back in the day, but according to his own book and Rock Scully's he was more of a drunk than anything - 70's and into the mid-80's beer and fine red wines. For gods sake the guy had a liver transplant...

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Gopher



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what I read in Jackson's book, the heavy smack was back and better than ever in June '91!

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DooDahDan



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Met a guy once who (supposedly) hooked Jer up between sets on 6/14/85. Jer asked him what he wanted to hear, to which he replied "Dew, Doll and Comes A Time". So that would be my vote if the story is true.

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Grateful_nirvanA



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Those greenfox rants are insane! But, to each his or her own.

I have always thought JG was on something 11/20/78. If it wasn't H, perhaps is was cola. Either way, as soon as the lyrics dissolve, no matter what the song, he basically just steps on the gas and goes. The band plays catch up the whole second set. This is certainly not a night when the music played the band. To my ears, it really sounds like JG had something going through his brain that HAD to get out via his guitar that night. It's like he was a freight train and nothing, other than those pesky lyrics, was going to slow him down. JG acting as both the conductor and the engineer. "Climb aboard boys, we're about to hit top speed!"
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